Human Rights in The World

[corky]

we often say that the old generation left us a very damaged world about democracy & ecology...i think it's true ...i also think it's our right & dutty (us:new generation) to talk about it if we want to change the world in a better place or at least if we wanna changes mind's people...
i live in a country where democracy & human rights are respected...we're totally free to express ourselves  with syndicates/associations & even Gvt organisations...i just can't imagine i could live in a country where i would have the right to have just 1 child ,where i wouldn't have the right to express my faith & believes,where i couldn't have the sexuality i want to ,where i would have to adopt a common view & unique speech...
we all here come from different countries&places (France ,USA,Polland,Italy,Serbia,Spain,England,India,Prague,Istanbul...) we can freely talk together about this ...so let's do it....

[JustChecking]

When it comes to democracy, I love what H. L. Mencken said:

Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance.
I confess I enjoy democracy immensely. It is incomparably idiotic, and hence incomparably amusing.
Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

As for human rights, that's a damn hard question...
I'm all for human rights, when it comes to "good" people (whatever is your sense of goodness of people)... I hate when e.g. fascists or nationalists are talking about their right of expression, and that the "totalitarian democracy" is trying to shup them up... What's the answer there?

I'm all for human rights, now it's up to people to be all good, to each other and to themselves...

E.g. Orwell's 1984 - being under 24/7 surveillance is probably one of the worst things that can happen to anyone; on the other hand, how many cases of domestic violence could be pre-emptied by it?...

We're living in a humane society, but many people behave very inhuman; I, for myself, would not think even one minute whether I want to be humane to child abuser or murderer...

I think that we made (at least in theory) a perfect scale, or "set of rules", what is humane and what should be human rights; now it's up to people to become human...

Wow, sorry for the depressive tone...

[corky]

wow...i didn't think it would goes so deep so fast ,JoDarling...

about Humans Rights in general i think we can say Human Rights are not respected when Leaders/Gvts are behaving with their own population/people like don't respects their right to exist in all that implies...

about humans not behaving like humans i agree...for murderers & child abusers ,i think they've lost their social& basic rights at the second they've touched/killed their victims...i see no difference between killing someone & raping a child...but personally i would tell you i see no difference between killing a human & killing an animal...a life is a life ,if you take off someone's life ,you have to be ready to pay the price...

i think real Democracy is when (ex) fascists,nationalists,communists etc...can say things (no matters if those things are uglly/disgusting/stupid or what) without being arrested & put in jail without any trial,thier families & friends arrested or harassed...
a country doesn't respect Human Rights & Democracy when you're arrested ,put in jail (even tortured or killed )because you've said something against GVT....

[JustChecking]

wow...i didn't think it would goes so deep so fast ,JoDarling...

haha, yeah, sorry... i guess it's cuz i'm lately (last several years) so disgusted with the state of the world today

...but personally i would tell you i see no difference between killing a human & killing an animal...a life is a life ,if you take off someone's life ,you have to be ready to pay the price...

yeah, i agree with you totally on this point...
[i'm not going to continue this direction, cuz i'd end up debating (with myself, as is my style) about euthanasia and other such topics]

i think real Democracy is when (ex) fascists,nationalists,communists etc...can say things (no matters if those things are uglly/disgusting/stupid or what) without being arrested & put in jail [...]

i totally agree with you, i just didn't express myself on this point as i should have - i wanted to say, that i'm always surprised by the irony of them calling for right for freedom of expression, yet being part of movement, that if they would get to the power, there would not be anymore freedom of speech... of course, i always say, "you can tell to me whatever you want, as long as you're not forcing your 'believes' on me"... e.g. i don't mind anyone talking to me about their religion or political views, as long as they're not trying to convince me "at all cost" that it's the best one...

a country doesn't respect Human Rights & Democracy when you're arrested ,put in jail (even tortured or killed) because you've said something against GVT....

no doubt there...
this is a simple symptom of the need for power - when you already got up, get rid of all that are against you... just a funny thing about todays world is, that before this was the difference between democratic and totallitarian systems, yet these days so many of systems that call themselves democratic or even "democracy" behave that way...

i'm really too depressive for this thread, i guess... most of todays world simply sickens me too much, i guess... sorry

[corky]

Don't be sorry at all...
the world today is a strange place to live in... i think money has changed everything...we now can talk about freedom of people & democracy and also make economic deals with Gvts that don't respect Democracy at all...that's something that just makes me angry...money doesn't make humans better:it doesn't work for people & it doesn't work for Gvts...
there was a time when ideals & principles meant something....nowdays only money means something...
my own gvt makes deals with countries despite miserable conditions of living of people & almost no freedom......

[Gary]

I know what you mean, but it always makes me laugh a little when people talk about humans not acting like humans, as if they could do things that aren't possible for humans to do. The range of human behavior is very broad and it seems to me that just because we don't like certain behaviors, doesn't make the behaviors any less human... but I get what you're trying to say. I think some people are just wired up to behave in ways that most people find abhorrent. What to do about these people is one of mankind's biggest dilemmas, IMO.

To me capital punishment gives far to much power to the state. I'm ashamed that my country still has it legal in many states. And it's no surprise at all to me that a person like George Bush would be in charge (in Texas) when the most executions in modern times would take place. Anyway, capital punishment is very satisfying in theory to a lot of people because they view it as justice, but I will never be swayed in my thoughts about this. The most civilized countries in this world have outlawed it and they are smart to do this. My country is dragging far behind with the likes of China and Iran, North Korea etc.

As for democracy, I live in the USA so I have no idea what that is.

[corky]

As for democracy, I live in the USA so I have no idea what that is.

OOOOOOOOOh no...Dear...living in the USA is living in Democracy ,you know it....justice system isn't perfect ,that's very true & year after year ,we realise many huge & dramatic mistakes have been made (like this man who's been innocented after 27years in jail) but you can't say it's not a Democracy...if you want to debate about Death Penalty that could be quite long...
some crimes are so abominable that their authors should pay the ultimate price....even if sometimes i think Death Penalty could be changed in jail for life but no democratic countries apply it...the simple idea of freedom of expression belongs to Democracy...you can't judge a Democracy about the failures & mistakes of its justice...but you can evaluete it on the simple fact that you can say 'it doesn't work..it's not good'...
If you can criticize your Gvt without going in jail ,if your wife can go out alone without having to hide her body & face behind a 'ghost costume' without taking risks to be lapided,if you can be homosexual without going in jail,if you can write down on the internet whatever you want without being arrested,if you can choose to have 1,2 or more children,if you can vote,if you can freely express your religion (or non-religion or your belief etc) ,if you can say what belongs to you really belongs to YOU,if you can go in a foreign country,go back & write a book about how your country /Gvt is bad(ex) without being re-educated etc....then you live in Democracy...despite our systems are not perfect or have disfunctions ,YOU in the USA & me in France ,we're living in OBVIOUS DEMOCRACIES....
 i wish members who lived under Communist GVT to tell us about how wonderful that was (irony)....


PS: i work for someone who dared to tell his(former)president that ,more or less ,he was a bad bad bastard...now my boss lives in a foreign country & protected by foreign S.Services& can't travell in the world like he'd like to(he's billionnaire)....and some people of his country have been murdered or poisonned abroad...don't tell me that's democracy...

[corky]

im so sad for damages caused by cyclone Nargis....U.N officials said Nargis might have killed 100,000 people....in normal country with normal Gvt ,international aids ,material & food would be authorized to arrive quickly to face this huge drama...but with Myanmar's isolationist regime ,of course ,things aren't so easy...seems everyone is ready to send food & medical supplies  but the military junta just blocks UN emergency airlift ( 22tons of emergency help are ready to be sent)...that's pretty dramatic....they care so less about people that they're reluctent to accept international help...it's disgusting....
Military junta ,on power since 1962,has put a total & incredible dictature on country ....generals are usually so paranoid to international arrivals,even humanitary, that i doubt they would let UN help arrive this time....but i pray for that...

[corky]

so G.W.Bush & N.Sarkosy
 will both go to the O.G opening ceremony in Beijing....   F#@% !!!!!!!